Micronational Cartography Society

Beaugium, New Brittania, Novatainia and Passas all have a bit of an issue regarding the way the MCS is run. There has been a discussion at Novatainia's FAT Dept. and some points were raised:

Jeremy says:

Yes he[Benkern] is[a citizen of NB], which means he can't vote on it[NB expansion]. Spangle is from our nation too, however he's voted on our expansion and its been allowed because he voted no. But it doesn't matter that that's wildly against the rules because of course the admin council are secure in their thought that the members won't do anything to prevent them breaking their own rules. I am of the belief they will be quite shocked this time.

Andreas says:

So you mean your claim gets processed with four, maybe three members because one is in your nation? That doesn't sound good ...

I'm really starting to think we should renew that push for elections/open council chambers ...

Andreas spoke again, saysing:

Though, Davis, they pride themselves on a map a week ...
If they get through them in under a week, I'm happy. But lately ...
Especially something like a military base - should be just "yup"

And you as one person CAN do something ... if enough of us got annoyed and demanded open admin/elections. But we're not doing another GSO ...

Jeremy says:

No carry on, i personally am all for an angry mob bugging the MCS into actually doing things fairly instead of just assuming they can treat the members like crap and assuming we'll just take it.

Points raised afterwards included the MCS admins being too godly and members not having any say, the council areas being private and the system of voting being unfair

Though, Davis, they pride themselves on a map a week ...
If they get through them in under a week, I'm happy. But lately ...
Especially something like a military base - should be just "yup"

And you as one person CAN do something ... if enough of us got annoyed and demanded open admin/elections. But we're not doing another GSO ...

This was in response to me saying this:

I know that my opinion doesn't matter on this subject since I have no power in the MCS, but they could also have a monthly voting session instead of what they do. I mean like, at the end of each month they vote on each claim that has been submitted during that month. That way everyone gets their answer at the same time, and all accepted claims for that month are added to the map at the same time.

It's just a thought.

i've all but given up.

OK... let's just say something.

my vote wasn't counted... and isn't counted... this is probably the only reason i'm still an NB citizen...


Reading through the archives i see something. when we opened it i can't find any votes from pete or max.. now you can't say open it because then they won't vote... and you can't say just remove them from the council because where would we be? on a fucking hosted forum

If the council are doing things fairly none of the admins should have anything to hide

True... but the fact here is even if we do things fairly we get some people who manipulate words.

King Jeremy II wrote: A member of the MCS admin council regarding New Brittanias expansion:

Well, i say NO

Then two posts later:

How large is this new expansion anyway?

Democracy in full swing

Neglecting to mension Fenix's very persuasive argument in the middle making people re-think ideas.

Persuasive arguement or not: it doesn't change the fact that admin didn't have a clue what they were rejecting and would of carried on if it werent for fenix

as i said on MSN:

maybe they had strong negative feelings due to information of the nation's inactivity or something then fenix made his speech and they got more accepting for that nation

What happens now Fenix isn't here?

we get claims through quicker

and as soon as my MCS votes files are back i will have more time to concentrate and write post essays

It might be better to have well considered decisions than quick ones

dr-spangle wrote:we get claims through quicker

and as soon as my MCS votes files are back i will have more time to concentrate and write post essays

I can't even imagine how long it took claims to be accepted while he was around then.

115 days one took waiting for fenix.


and they're not taking bloody long... 14 days compared with 30 seems pritty reasonable to me...

Damn, maybe I'd be more patient if I was during most of his time.

Can I just say a couple things, before this gets too serious?

I remember, probably 2-3 weeks ago, when everyone was praising the council for their efficiency in getting claims done in under a week. This just shows how fickle people are ... but the important thing is that if the council is operating efficiently, nobody seems too worried.

On democracy and so on - there are always questions raised about this, and some day the council will have to face it. The same with open council chambers. But consider this: if the council isn't corrupt, they have nothing to hide, and the chambers should be open. If they are corrupt, then all the more reason for members to see to stop this, and they should be open. Either way ...

I think we'll all agree though that the MCS is the best mapping organisation there is, and none of us want to leave it or start the next GSO. However, any organisation can improve - and since almost everyone micronation on here embraces democracy, why not the council? Or open chambers. Either way, we all want to ensure the council is doing the best job it can, and that claims that deserve it get through, not on rivalry, personal bias or anything, but on the proper reasons nations deserve land: Activity, Culture and How they use the land.

I still think the council do a damn good job, but I can also empathise with where these arguments are coming from.

Maybe some changes are needed, but that's not for me to say. Unless there's some kind of vote, then maybe I would get a say...

As it was said previously. 'A society has members, not customers.'

So, each member is part of the society, and everyone should do their bit toward the running of the society. This also means the Council (no names mentioned) should be a bit less 'nose-in-the-air' when it comes to it's members. After all, where would the Council be without members.

I support this. It's too hard to taunt the GSO for plotting behind their members' backs when we have a similarly locked forum. I understand that in the interests of fairness some council members might want to keep their votes private, and I think they're right to want to do so, but it just creates too much of an atmosphere of suspicion.

Suggestion - have an open forum here, and then secretly start another invisible forum somewhere else if you have to have any REALLY sensitive discussions. That way everyone's happy.

for sensitive discussion people use IM & PM.

i was thinking about this...

many members want their claim to be kept secret so if the council was oepned a couple of claims would need to be done in admin disscussion...

who has claimed in secret?

as jeremy said, we are supposed to protect the information of our members if they ask for it to be secret it shall be kept secret.

How could you claim in secret? Wouldn't people eventually notice your territory had gotten bigger anyway?