Petition/Suggestion/Grevience.

UEC · Post by **UEC** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 4:21 pm

This has been bugging me for ages. Ever since it was done. The MCS should NOT name the world it created. That should be left to the individual nations to decide what their cultures/governments call the world. We should simply refer to it as the MCS World Map, for as the MCS that is ALL it is to us. A map. It is not culturally defined or anything. 
 
It is my oppinion as founder of the MCS that when the world was given an officially sactioned name (Micras) the MCS violated the mandate and spirit the organization was founded under. I move that the name be removed from the MCS World Map and that no name be officially endorsed by the MCS as an organization. This does not restrict people from continueing to use the name Micras if they so choose, but it also does not impress upon nations the cultures of others.

E. Metzler (UEC) 
Duke of Brookshire 
"Never use a BOO//ist as a diplomat" -- GS 
<a href="http://pub9.ezboard.com/bshireroth">Clicky Clicky...</a>, Tiss for your own good ya know. 
Edited by: <A HREF=http://p100.ezboard.com/bmicronationaln ... C</A>  <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://www.ezboard.com/ezgfx/gicons/white_fire.gif" BORDER=0> at: 14/11/05 21:22

extreme007 · Post by **extreme007** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 4:50 pm

i disagree... we need MCS to say what the world is called.... if other nations want to use another name, they are free to do so... however, when we come here, internationally, to talk about something, we need to refer to a common name. And this name, has to be chosen by the MCS, which it has, and is called Mircas.

Discover, Invent, Theories, Experiment, 
 
Advance Science, 
Advance Extremism, 
(in <a href="http://www.karnali.co.nr/" target="top">Karnali, Republic of</a>)

Bill3000 · Post by **Bill3000** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 5:14 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>It is my oppinion as founder of the MCS that when the world was given an officially sactioned name (Micras) the MCS violated the mandate and spirit the organization was founded under.<hr></blockquote> 
 
I'd like to mention that it was under your administration that the name was created, and you agreed to it at the time. Scott created the name, and the people agreed to it. 
 
Either way, this point is nil, as that is the offical stance of the MCS is as you say. It is just that everyone calls it Micras, so it does not mean much. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/tongue.gif ALT=":P">

<center>Bill Dusch - Archon of Soloralism 
<a href="http://www.shireroth.org/guide.html">Citizen of Shireroth</a> Baron of Antya 
Proud to be Apollonian 
<script language="Javascript">
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Emperador Augustin · Post by **Emperador Augustin** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 6:41 pm

Like Bill said, everyone already calls it Micras. And it came to such a wide point of use for the name that the only logical route was to officially adopt. 
 
If you recall, I held off endorsing the name for a long time. 
 
I'll also point out that endorsing the name does not impress upon anyone's culture. People are free to call it whatever they like. Just as Northworthy calls it Midgard/Midgart. Micras is simply the common name.

<div style="text-align:center"><a href="http://p074.ezboard.com/fmicronationaln ... <img src="http://www.hometown.aol.com/augustinbar ... gpart1.gif" style="border:0;"/></a><a href="http://www.geocities.com/microcartography"><img src="http://www.hometown.aol.com/augustinbar ... gpart2.gif" style="border:0;"/></a><a href="http://p202.ezboard.com/bbabkha"><img src="http://www.hometown.aol.com/augustinbar ... gpart3.gif" style="border:0;"/></a><a href="http://p217.ezboard.com/bminorca" target="top"><img src="http://www.hometown.aol.com/augustinbar ... gpart4.gif" style="border:0;"/></a></div>

Harvey the Blue · Post by **Harvey the Blue** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 7:15 pm

Your logic makes no sense at all. Why should the governments of the nations choose the name of the map? They don't choose the shape of the continents or the people that update it. Their input is limited to what initial territory they want and what it looks like, and even that is (and always has been) with the approval of the MCS staff. 
 
Some people like the idea that they are part of something greater. Micras has a name; it's a place that sort-of exists. Not everyone hates the sector like you do, Erik.

Harvey Steffke 
<a href="http://www.livejournal.com/users/saikar/">Sai'Kar's Memories LiveJournal</a> - ranting about Shirerothian issues since fall 2004.

Osman Shahanshah · Post by **Osman Shahanshah** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:01 pm

I might not like the culture from which it first originated but I accept it now that it has entered popular usage. Micras I think will and should stay the accepted name.

<div style="text-align:center"> 
<img src="http://www.geocities.com/ardashirkhan/S ... Palace.txt" style="border:0;"/> 
 
</div>

President Darcy of Anthel · Mon Nov 14, 2005 10:33 pm

I am with the majority - the name of the planet is Micras. 
 
Let's look at it this way. Hundreds of years ago, the real-life planet we are on was not called "Earth" by the Chinese, the Hindus, the Bengalis, the Malays, the Native Americans, the Inuit, etc etc. The name "Earth" comes from an old Nordic word, if I am not mistaken. 
 
So, what is the difficulty in just taking "Micras" as the English word for our micronational planet and, if you really feel it necessary, use another word in your local dialect? 
 
Harvey the Blue - "Their input is limited to what initial territory they want and what it looks like" - I would like to see a lot more proactivity from the established nations on Micras. The MCS map gives us coastlines, very broad-scale terrain, and some major rivers, but the geography of islands and continents of this size is surely going to be far more detailed. Anthelia sponsored an effort a few months ago to really add serious detail to our continent (shared by Gotzborg, Alexandria, Natopia and Lavalon), and this met with good enthusiasm and support from those nations. In the fullness of time, I am hoping to see the same approach taken with the rest of Micras, assuming our independent efforts can harmonise. 
 
But this is not the major problem with the map of Micras, as we know. The major problem is the rectangular projection and the consequent distortion of land shapes and distances away from the equator. 

<hr /> 
Cheers 
 
John P Darcy 
President 
Republic of Anthelia<img src="http://anthelia.net/mn/flag_anim_68x50.gif" style="border:0;"/>

King of Gotzborg · Post by **King of Gotzborg** » Mon Nov 14, 2005 10:36 pm

+2 with President Darcy! 
 
I think everyone should endeavour to engage themselves in the 'fleshing out' of their pixelated home! 
 
ACII

UEC · Post by **UEC** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:23 am

To Bill and Harvey.. this has nothing to do with your Solorarilslsm.. god I can't spell the name.. or Apollo. It's been buggin me ever since it was done.. and I was against it than... but went along with it for some reason. I retracted it later, and Ryan put it back. 
 
I'm not saying people have to stop using it. I just don't feel it was ever the place of the MCS to name the world. For ages it was simply called, the "MCS world map", "the world" "the map"...etc.. If people still wanted to use Micras.. I'm not saying we should stop them. They proly would. I just don't feel it is the MCS's place to give an official name to the world. it should be dictated by individuals choices, cultures and governments. Not by this organization.

E. Metzler (UEC) 
Duke of Brookshire 
"Never use a BOO//ist as a diplomat" -- GS 
<a href="http://pub9.ezboard.com/bshireroth">Clicky Clicky...</a>, Tiss for your own good ya know.

President Darcy of Anthel · Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:56 am

What exactly is your point? The name "Micras" is now entrenched, even if MCS disowns it. Just exactly how do you want the MCS to proceed? 
 
By the way, your lack of spelling ability was evident right at the start of this thread.

<hr /> 
Cheers 
 
John P Darcy 
President 
Republic of Anthelia<img src="http://anthelia.net/mn/flag_anim_68x50.gif" style="border:0;"/>

Layal1 · Post by **Layal1** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:10 am

I have to agree. Think about our own world. Everybody calls Earth, Earth. Somebody might have called it by a different names ages ago, but eventually it stuck on Earth. Kind alike Micras. It doesn't mean another nation my have a different name for it in its history. They might had called the giant Melon, but today, scientists, businessmen and politicians call it Micras.

bert of liberi · Post by **bert of liberi** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:00 pm

throughout history everything changes, even the things we once viewed as necessary to our existence

Nathan of Natopia · Post by **Nathan of Natopia** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:04 pm

I agree with Erik... what we call the world should be an internal decision. Go to an online translator, how many langauges have the English "earth" translate into "earth" in their own language? 
 
Or, a more abstract thought, what about when we (as in humanity) name other planets? We call the red planet next to us Mars, but the *hypothetical* natives would have a different name entirely. 
 
It's just like why a chair is called a chair... it depends on what language/culture you are in... why, its a Stuhl to a German, not a chair. "Earth" is not the official name of our real planet... the Germans call it Masse, French call it la terre, the Spaniards tierre... but the *equivalent* of those words is Earth. 
 
Also, I have a lot of maps on my mall... maps of the world. They arn't titles "Earth" but the all say "The World."

graius · Post by **graius** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 8:25 pm

Yes but the difference here is that this map is intended primarily for Anglophone nations.

<a href="http://www.treithar.net"><img src="http://www.bestshottheatre.co.uk/images/sig.GIF" border=0></a>

Bill3000 · Post by **Bill3000** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:24 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>It's just like why a chair is called a chair... it depends on what language/culture you are in... why, its a Stuhl to a German, not a chair. "Earth" is not the official name of our real planet... the Germans call it Masse, French call it la terre, the Spaniards tierre... but the *equivalent* of those words is Earth. 
 
Also, I have a lot of maps on my mall... maps of the world. They arn't titles "Earth" but the all say "The World." <hr></blockquote> 
 
While I do see your point, there is a slight flaw in your argument - all micronations on Micras speak the same common language. Absolutely there could be other names for other languages - the thing is that most of those other languages would be conlangs. Few that speak English call Earth Terra or Gaia, unless they are being poetic, although they mean the same thing. 
 
By the way, it's kind of odd to call it "English", considering the fact that there is no England on Micras. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/tongue.gif ALT=":P">

<center>Bill Dusch - Archon of Soloralism 
<a href="http://www.shireroth.org/guide.html">Citizen of Shireroth</a> Baron of Antya 
Proud to be Apollonian 
<script language="Javascript">
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Nathan of Natopia · Post by **Nathan of Natopia** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 11:19 pm

Then what should it be called? Micrish? <img src=http://www.members.lycos.co.uk/siriain/ ... carrot.gif ALT=":carrot">

His Sovereign Majesty, Nathan 
Soivereign Natopian Emperor 
 
<a href="http://natopia.cjb.net">Natopia</a> 
<a href="http://chancellornate.proboards20.com">Forums</a> 
 
Join the Renaissance! <a href="http://chancellornate.proboards20.com/i ... ry">Empire Library</a>

Bill3000 · Post by **Bill3000** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 11:58 pm

Sounds odd. I think Common would work for now until we have an actual name. 
 
Oooh! Audente! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/tongue.gif ALT=":P">

<center>Bill Dusch - Archon of Soloralism 
<a href="http://www.shireroth.org/guide.html">Citizen of Shireroth</a> Baron of Antya 
Proud to be Apollonian 
<script language="Javascript">
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</script></center>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p100.ezboard.com/bmicronationaln ... ill3000</A> at: 16/11/05 4:58

extreme007 · Post by **extreme007** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:33 am

ice cream?

Discover, Invent, Theories, Experiment, 
 
Advance Science, 
Advance Extremism, 
(in <a href="http://www.karnali.co.nr/" target="top">Karnali, Republic of</a>)

Fax Celestis · Post by **Fax Celestis** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:20 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> all micronations on Micras speak the same common language.<hr></blockquote> 
 
And I see the flaw in your argument. No they do not all speak the same language. Last I checked, there were a few non-Anglophonic nations on the MCS map.

<hr /><div style="text-align:center"> 
<a href="http://www.livejournal.com/~Fax_Celestis"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/ ... </a> 
Viatax Sitadi Axdivijink Regigoraauk</div>

Bill3000 · Post by **Bill3000** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 9:37 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>And I see the flaw in your argument. No they do not all speak the same language. Last I checked, there were a few non-Anglophonic nations on the MCS map. <hr></blockquote> 
Maybe so, but do they actually have contact with the rest of Micras? That is the exception, not the rule, and it does not mean that the generalization is false just because there are some exceptions. Last time I checked, when those nations do have diplomacy matters with the rest of Micras, they speak in English, not in their own native languages, in the same way that English is like in the real world. English is still the international language for our sector.

<center>Bill Dusch - Archon of Soloralism 
<a href="http://www.shireroth.org/guide.html">Citizen of Shireroth</a> Baron of Antya 
Proud to be Apollonian 
<script language="Javascript">
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</script></center>

Harvey the Blue · Post by **Harvey the Blue** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 11:10 am

Hello, welcome to a forum where people are allowed to discuss things. Some people call this forum Micronations.net, but we highly encourage everyone to come up with their own name. The purpose of Micro... (I apologise, old habits die hard, in no way am I encouraging you to call Mic... this forum what I do) these boards are to discuss a hobby of nation building that a few people have called "micronationalism," but of course you are free to refer to it as whatever your heart desires. 
 
A subdivision of these boards is a group dedicated to creating maps to aid and amuse the people that are involved in the hobby of simulating nations. This subdivision has no official name as we are in no way forcing people to refer to it by any particular label, but some of the more witty among us have nicknamed it the "Micronational Cartography Society" 
 
<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/tired.gif ALT="|I"> 
 
So the MCS gave the map a name? So friggin what? The MCS has a name. Shireroth has a name. I don't see anyone at Shireroth encouraging people to come up with their own name for the country. Why? Because that's friggin stupid! 
 
Yeah, okay, so other countries can refer to the map Micras by other names. I guess they could also change their land map holdings to better fit what they want. Add some major rivers, rename some islands, say you have tons of oil and gold natural resources, heck, delete the countries around you so that you're on your own island just like everyone wants. By altering what you're given, you're not really on the map of Micras anymore. You're doing your own little thing. If that's what you want than sure, go ahead, but those kinds of simulations don't really tie into the MCS map. 
 
And by the way Erik, the "something greater" I refered to wasn't Soloralism or Apollo. It's this map. There are so few successful international organizations tying people togethe because so few have a purpose. The MCS is successful because it DOES have a purpose: to unite people on one planet. And let's face it, the planet is better with a name. I'm glad they made a decision and adopted a name, because with as much squabbling that goes on in this hobby, we would have never agreed on something by ourselves.

graius · Post by **graius** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 12:46 pm

Are there any non-anglophone nations in the room that object to the name Micras? 
 
EDIT: Emphasis

<a href="http://www.treithar.net"><img src="http://www.bestshottheatre.co.uk/images/sig.GIF" border=0></a>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p100.ezboard.com/bmicronationaln ... s</A>  <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://www.treithar.net/favicon.ico" BORDER=0> at: 16/11/05 21:38

King of Gotzborg · Post by **King of Gotzborg** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 12:51 pm

Gotzborg doesn't. Even if we did, we wouldn't care, we would just call it something else for our own purposes. 
 
ACII

bert of liberi · Post by **bert of liberi** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:57 pm

Nope, Mayo doesn't

Micronational Cartography Society

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